Author Topic: 1988 AK 1234 Front brake lines  (Read 555 times)

ak1234

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1988 AK 1234 Front brake lines
« on: June 11, 2018, 01:18:03 »
would anyone know where i can get front brake lines for my 1998 # AK 1234 .   preferably in the USA .. so maybe knowing the application would be better and i guess a vendor in either the UK or USA.  The brake line is aprox 45cm = 18"

Any info would help 


Thanks Ron
« Last Edit: June 11, 2018, 01:20:31 by ak1234 »

jmohara

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Re: 1988 AK 1234 Front brake lines
« Reply #1 on: June 12, 2018, 02:14:51 »
Hose and Fittings in Sacramento CA. I got coated braided lines but they can match original too. Just send over the old ones

ak1234

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Re: 1988 AK 1234 Front brake lines
« Reply #2 on: June 19, 2018, 01:33:30 »
these brake lines are 18" long and male x male ... i searched everywhere ? 

Ron

westcott

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Re: 1988 AK 1234 Front brake lines
« Reply #3 on: October 15, 2018, 14:27:49 »
Hello all MK IV drivers,

who can support me with the technical dimension of our front and rear brake lines/hoses???
I'm just talking about the rubber lines.

I'm in contact with company Spiegler here in Germany, they can cut and press a set of brake lines in between a few days if ordered.
They will be assembled from braided lines and stainless fittings.

I have the front lines at home from an other car and will check for dimensions.

What I need is:

1.Total lengths till end of the fittings
2.Typ of fitting
3.Technical detail for fitting like male, female, banjo, length of mail fitting thread
4.Fixation at the car, for example by bracket with hole and male fitting with union nut or by bracket and metal clip or so on, pictures showing the fittings assembled in the car are welcome.

My theoretical description (details just an example and not measured, based on Ron's pictures) for the standard front BMW brake version would be:
Over all length: 18"
Fitting A: male, M10x1, 30mm long thread, fixing by bracket and union nut.
Fitting B: male, M10x1, 30mm long thread, fixing by bracket and union nut

The angle of the male or female end fittings will be checked and adjusted with the original caliper tech details.

Price will be somewhere in the 170€ range for a set incl. TÜV certification or ABE.
TÜV certification or ABE is very imortant für Gemany to avoid problems with upcomming tech inspections at TÜV.

   
« Last Edit: October 15, 2018, 14:56:17 by westcott »
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westcott

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Re: 1988 AK 1234 Front brake lines
« Reply #4 on: October 22, 2018, 15:58:42 »
I found some old disassembled front hoses in my small parts shed and did some measurement:

At the moment it looks like the following:

Front hoses:
Over all length: 18"
Fitting A: male, 3/8"UNF, 1" long thread, fixing by bracket and union nut.
Fitting B: male, 3/8"UNF, 1" long thread, fixing by bracket and union nut

Rear hoses:
Over all length: 23"
Fitting A: male, 3/8"UNF, 1" long thread, fixing by bracket and union nut
Fitting B: male, M10x1 ?, fitted with copper ring, need to check disassembled by next weekend
« Last Edit: December 06, 2018, 11:52:07 by westcott »
Everything should be made as simple as possible, but not simpler!

westcott

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Re: 1988 AK 1234 Front brake lines
« Reply #5 on: December 06, 2018, 11:35:36 »
Final status for the brake hoses!

I decided on a braided hoses set Co. Spiegler in Gemany made for me.

I measure and found out the following original Autokraft technical details for the front and rear hoses used on my car with BMW caliper front and Peugeot/Talbot calipers rear:

Front:
Over all length: 18"
Fitting A: male, 3/8"UNF, 1" long thread, fixing by bracket and union nut.
Fitting B: male, 3/8"UNF, 1" long thread, fixing by bracket and union nut

Rear:
Over all length: 23"
Fitting A: male, 3/8"UNF, 1" long thread, fixing by bracket and union nut
Fitting B: male, M10x1, fitted with copper ring

Based on that information I defined my set as:

General:
-Braided lines
-Black cover to have a more conservative look
-Stainless steel fittings and union nuts
-Loose fitting on the rear line brake side
-All other fittings 3/8" UNF

-All fittings used by Spiegler have "universal" cones. That means they are male and female. You may find that design for brake fittings also in universal self assembled brake tube systems available on the market because the suppliers want to reduce part number amount and storage.

In detail the male cone has some small female cone directly around the bore, works without problems on my installation.

Front:
The over all length was increased from original 18" to 480mm or 18.9" to have a bit more length because braided lines ar often not that flexible as rubber ones
The length between the hex heads, so the real length between the brackets on the caliper and on the lower wishbone, was increased to 17"
Both fittings have 3/" UNF, male/female cone, 1" thread length

Rear:
The over all length was increased from original 23" to 620mm or 24.4"
The length between the hex heads was increased to 23"
The fitting on the frame side, joining the hard lines, has 3/8" UNF
The fitting on the brake side, directly screwed into the Peugeot/Talbot calipers has M10x1mm but is changed from "cutted to length" to "loose fitting". With that fitting installation is more easy because the brake line now has 2 "loose" ends. With the cutted to length M10 you need to tighten the fitting into the brake caliper first and then install the frame side fitting to avoid twisting of the line.
With the loose fitting you can start whereever you want and twisting can be avoided.

The complete set of 4 incl. shipping was 128,22 € inclusive the "Schnorr" lock washers. The "Schnorr" lock washers are disk springs.

Top: Package of 4 as delivered (2 parts removed, installed in the car for check and testing)

Second from top: 3/8 UNF fitting with male/female cone, stainless, nut and Schnorr lock washer

Third from top: M10x1mm loose fitting, also male/female cone

Bottom: Complete rear braided brake tube with black cover and stainless fittings   
« Last Edit: December 06, 2018, 11:57:20 by westcott »
Everything should be made as simple as possible, but not simpler!

westcott

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Re: 1988 AK 1234 Front brake lines
« Reply #6 on: December 06, 2018, 12:52:38 »
This is the original brake tube from AC Autokraft for the rear Peugeot/Talbot caliper.

The male 3/8" UNF cone of the fitting was cutted off to shorten the fitting. This was done to avoid the bottom out of the fitting in the brake caliper before it is seated and the copper sealing ring is compressed.

You may see the metal saw blade cut lines on the cutted end.

In general this is not a bad solution if You use the same thread for both parts and a step is at the fitting to create some good sealing interfaces.

But, on my car they cutted the 3/8" UNF to a length allowing it to be screwed into the M10x1 inner thread with female cone of the caliper and I think this is what they did for all production parts.

So both threads are not the same and have some end play but will seal and work if torque is applied during the assembly.

This is the reason why the decission was made for the M10x1 loose fitting vs original cutted fitting on the new rear brake tubes.

 
« Last Edit: December 06, 2018, 12:54:59 by westcott »
Everything should be made as simple as possible, but not simpler!