Author Topic: CSX 2000 to CSX 2074 Photographs  (Read 2865 times)

rstainer

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CSX 2000 to CSX 2074 Photographs
« on: April 17, 2018, 13:46:59 »
California-based Robert Walker, author of the highly-acclaimed ‘Cobra Pilote-The Ed Hugus Story’, is writing an account of each of the early worm & sector Cobras for publication later this year.

He is looking for photographs (other than from the normal sources) of any Cobras from CSX 2000 to CSX 2074 and would greatly appreciate any help you could give. If you have anything of potential interest, please contact Robert Walker at <bobwalker1400@gmail.com>. Credit for photos published will have photographer's name listed in each caption.

'Cobra Pilote' is an excellent addition to serious Cobra reference works and I encourage you to help this author.

Robin Stainer
AC Owners' Club Cobra Registrar

B.P.Bird

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Re: CSX 2000 to CSX 2074 Photographs
« Reply #1 on: April 18, 2018, 00:03:07 »
Robin you are quite right the Walker book on Ed Hugus is well worth a read and explodes some Shelby myths. Speaking of myths none of these early Cobras ever used anything but a Bishop Cam and Peg Steering box. Endless repetition of 'worm and sector' does not make it true .......

rr64

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Re: CSX 2000 to CSX 2074 Photographs
« Reply #2 on: April 18, 2018, 13:35:13 »
I really enjoyed Mr. Walker’s book and that it brought Ed Hugus’ story out in public. Many long time Cobra owners have known much of the presented information for decades. A new book, sounds interesting. Some of us would hope that Mr. Walker doesn't perpetuate some other mythology including but not limited to:

CSX2000 was not painted different colors multiple times in 1962 to make the motoring press believe that there many more than one car finished. CSX2000 of course was first presented to the world in bare aluminum coachwork. It did get the famous bright yellow paint work as soon as the busy little team got around to it but it did not get repeat color changes. The first best proof is right in Shelby American “factory” photographs of CSX2000 taken about half way through the completion of CSX2101-CSX2200 contract cars. A series of photographs was taken from multiple angles specifically to show the differences between CSX2000 and the new latest chassis of the day. As of 1978 when I first examined the car it had only been painted twice from new, the bright yellow and the medium dark blue. Stone chips and nicks in the blue only showed yellow or aluminum under yellow underneath.

Chassis “before” CSX2075 were “260 Cobras”. The tricky part of that sentence is what does “before” mean? There was never a “260 Cobra” in the 1960s that I have found any reference to in any way. The earliest service parts lists published after coil spring chassis entered the pictures described leaf spring CSX2xxx chassis as “COBRA I” models. Even the term “289 Cobra” appears to have been a term the Shelby works service parts department came up (linking 289 engines and CSX2xxx chassis in a service parts list index) with after CSX30xx chassis necessitated customers telling the parts clerk what type of car they were talking about. The earliest date I have come across is the original sale of CSX2580 on June 26, 1965 being sold as a “289 Cobra”. The first time shipped to a dealer only two cars are documents as being sold as “289 Cobras” and both were very late cars with 1965 Fairlane engines and special high performance C4 automatic transmissions.  Back to engines. What engine a chassis received is more related to which “factory” did the final installation and when.  AC Cars and Ed Hugus appear to have used whatever engines they had already (XHP-260 or HP260) after Shelby in California switched to HP289s. Final assembly into running cars was not in numerical order and sometimes seems to have taken days or weeks to complete a given car in early days. Chassis CSX2039 and CSX2044 were both sold new with HP289 engines, as were several others “before” CSX2075. Recent investigations make it seem likely that CSX2074 also was fitted with a HP289.
Dan Case
1964 Cobra owner since 1983, Cobra crazy since I saw my first one in the mid 1960s in Huntsville, AL.

rstainer

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Re: CSX 2000 to CSX 2074 Photographs
« Reply #3 on: April 18, 2018, 14:39:37 »
Barrie,

We’ve discussed steering boxes before. ‘Worm’ is a descriptive word for the helical drive and ‘Sector’ is a descriptive word for the gear section (about a tenth of a full gear) that it engages. The cam and peg terminology is less widely used: it’s not cam as on a camshaft and it’s not peg as generally understood.

I also need to consider our US colleagues who received all the cars originally and still have the majority. ‘Worm & Sector’ is their standard terminology and I have yet to meet a US aficionado who refers to it as ‘Cam & Peg’.

So I’ll stick with worm and sector unless there’s general outrage from both sides of the pond.

Robin

B.P.Bird

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Re: CSX 2000 to CSX 2074 Photographs
« Reply #4 on: April 19, 2018, 12:02:21 »
Robin,
I see that we shall not agree on this matter. Apart from the terminology 'cam' and 'peg' being used by Bishop Cam themselves it was also the terminology used by A.C. Cars Ltd. However one should always go back to the most original source possible: In this instance it seems to be the patent application of  Reginald Bishop dated 1923. This extract is lifted from a Morgan Owners Club article:


"GB 223963 “Improvements in or relating to gearing for steering mechanically-propelled vehicles and
for other purposes”
This, a patent for a steering box, was applied for on July 25 1923 and has a publication date of 27 October
1924. The patent holder was Reginald Bishop, a Middlesex engineer, for a device operationally consisting of a
cam of helical form and constant diameter (at the lower end of the inner steering column) imparting motion via a
roller or peg attached to a lever projecting from the steering rocker shaft." 

The salient feature of the system is a cam. It is not a worm. The patent exactly explains this in the phrase 'of helical form' in other words were you to unroll the helical member in to a flat form you would see a rectangular plate with a single wide slot running diagonally across it. Anything engaging in that inclined or cammed slot (you might use a peg) can only move horizontally if it also moves vertically. In our steering box the 'horizonta'l movement is provided by the driver turning the steering wheel and the 'vertical' output is applied to the rocker arm and shaft via a peg.
However I fear the topic is rather obscure and one should desist from boring the readers. It does raise something more interesting though in terms of nomenclature and I will start a thread in the more appropriate General Forum.

rstainer

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Re: CSX 2000 to CSX 2074 Photographs
« Reply #5 on: April 21, 2018, 16:52:10 »
Any non-stock interesting CSX 2000 to 2074 photographs, please, to Bob Walker per first post contact details.

RS

rr64

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Re: CSX 2000 to CSX 2074 Photographs
« Reply #6 on: April 21, 2018, 20:09:30 »
Any non-stock interesting CSX 2000 to 2074 photographs, please, to Bob Walker per first post contact details.

RS

I am working to get Bob together with the owner of a car that has been out of use for many years.
Dan Case
1964 Cobra owner since 1983, Cobra crazy since I saw my first one in the mid 1960s in Huntsville, AL.

MkIV Lux

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Re: CSX 2000 to CSX 2074 Photographs
« Reply #7 on: December 04, 2021, 17:06:27 »
Looks like this book is now in the book stores  :)  on preorder for delivery end Jan 2022
https://www.chaters.co.uk/prod/21276/ac-inc-cobra/shelby-cobras-csx-2001-csx-2125
« Last Edit: December 04, 2021, 20:31:53 by MkIV Lux »