Author Topic: ac cobra prices????  (Read 16405 times)

nikbj68

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ac cobra prices????
« Reply #30 on: January 10, 2007, 06:42:37 »
quote:
Originally posted by cobham cobra
   
Hi Nick,
   Having just started my post-Christmas diet this is a very unfair photo to post.

   Deepest apologies....me too![:(]
   
quote:
So tell me, just how like Mallorca is Anglesey ?

   Erm. It`s an island. And 3/4 of the locals speak fairly good english! That`s about it really! [:D][:I]
   
quote:
Very impressed with you getting 39 PH as a 21st Birthday present BTW.
   Cheers - John.

   Yes. So was I! Just what I always wanted. Even if it only lasted for a day! I had NO idea that my Mum & (then) wife had arranged it all, and Nigel Hulme was SO generous with his time & attention, taking Mum & myself out for longdrives, the first time Mum had actually been driven in it, and allowing me to actually drive it around his property! Totally Amazing. I can still remember every minute....16 years later!!! [8D][8D][8D]
   
   Well, I`d better get back to the permatan work....
   Glad you`re not my Boss, Trevor![:p]

cobham cobra

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« Reply #31 on: January 10, 2007, 11:27:19 »
Jim, you said "Emmanuald is entitled to his opinion...no matter how far from correct it may be. After all...free speech and all that!"
   I completely agree and have no problem with that. Anybody that loves cars is fine with me especially when they have a preference for Cobras and AC's. I also have no problem with the replica industry, if it wasn't them I would never be able to source the Cobra/ AC/ Shelby parts and accessories. However, ever since I first saw Cobras racing in the late 60's early 70' I have wanted to own one. My MkIV is the realisation of that dream. To read a contribution on this forum that dismisses the entire MkIV model range in a single sentence was something I wanted to respond to.............so I did. Most of the club members that I know, drive either a MkIV, Superblower, CRS, 289 MkIII or Ace, the moderns have between 240 and 360 bhp and none of them could be described as slow. I appreciate that we are fortunate to have a friendly atmosphere in the ACOC and am happy to drop the topic, sit quietly in the corner and grumble to myself as I drink my beer and eat my pie.
   
   I notice Emmanuald has posted a photo elsewhere on this forum of his 428 and his car looks fantastic. With regard to Kirkhams, most people will agree that they are better built than the Cobras that came out of Thames Ditton.
   
   Now whose round is it ?
   Cheers - John.

jbottini

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ac cobra prices????
« Reply #32 on: January 11, 2007, 02:24:26 »
Cobham cobra,
   I agree with you 100% especially as an ex CSX 427 owner. My AK may not be as fast, but it certainly is as enjoyable, maybe more so, to drive albiet for different reasons. Emmanueld is entitled to his extremely misplaced opinions...but that is all they are..opinions. I've had the good fortune to drive 289's, 427's 427 S/C's, ride in a real GT40,deive the Ford GT, Brooklands Ace, Brooklands Aceca and Superblowers as well as enjoy my AK. All great cars for different reasons. The AK's were a continuation and in many respects, except stock raw horse power, an improvementover a 427 street car, but yet are not all that different except in raw hp. One can argue the asthetics of the few boby changes, the widening of the f & r track, the dash boards etc. But the basis concept of the car is intact...slightly updated and in many respects better. Those knowlkedgeable realize the MKIV line is a continuation/evolution of a 427 appreciate them for what they are.. a modern Cobra. Emmanueld's Frua is no more than a 427 frame with a 428 and a new body..beautiful, rare and unappreciated by most. It too is a evolution of a 427 Cobra. Kirkhams are great cars, probably better than original AC's not better in quality vs the MKIV and Superblower. In short I agree, Emmanuald's opinions are his own ..why he chose to post them on an AK MK IV web site, leaves me woundering if we should chip in for an MRI. Jim AK1113

Emmanueld

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« Reply #33 on: January 11, 2007, 02:57:53 »
I am not saying that the MKIV is a bad car! (Although mine was) This why I unloaded it as soon as I could. It was also a very early one, It was supposed to have been one of the two cars (with AK01) used by Ford  to federalize the MKIV. Please look at photos and try to put your bias aside, I am just saying this is a pale replica of the original the MKIII 289! As you say, it is my opinion! Maybe later models are better!
   I guess the interior was much improved later on, even the body shape was wrong on that one! I took this pictures shortly after I bought the car, we were trying to make it run right!
   By the way, before I forget! who cares if it's an Autocraft, Kirkham or even a Shelby! they are all replicas! [:D] I saw and drove one of those new Shelby's made in South Africa I presume, it was an aluminum car and the workmanship was dismal to say the least. What counts is the quality and how close to the original the design is. Over here in the states, A well built aluminum Shelby or Kirkham will sell well in excess of 100 grands, Twice as much as a MKIV!
   
   PS, I enjoy animated conversation! [:D]
   
   Emmanuel
   
   
   
   

ak1234

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« Reply #34 on: January 11, 2007, 03:53:16 »
if I may put in my 2 cents .... all I can say is the " original " cobra's were raw .. not fit to drive on the street.  The question is were the Originals ever really fully developed.  So which car is really the Best Cobra.  The Kits, MKIV, or the new Shelby's ... if you asked me on a sunday afternoon when I go to start up ak1234 and the battery is dead from sitting .. I have to say you'll here echoing of short burst some thing like Piece of %^&$ !! But to me as a 7 year old riding on the back deck of a GT350R, Pantera's and a 427 Cobra of my Dad's those cars were raw ... I would take my MKIV over one of those old chuck wagons any day.  Not insult intended.

nikbj68

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« Reply #35 on: January 11, 2007, 06:42:22 »
quote:
Originally posted by Emmanueld
   ...I saw and drove one of those new Shelby's made in South Africa I presume, it was an aluminum car and the workmanship was dismal to say the least....

   Can you elaborate on this? What`s bad; body/chassis, interior fit/finish etc?  I didn`t think they made Ali cars in S.A for Shelby.
   
quote:
Originally posted by Emmanueld
   ...PS, I enjoy animated conversation![:D]
   Emmanuel

   So do we! (as long as everyone plays nice!)[8D]

TLegate

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« Reply #36 on: January 11, 2007, 10:05:37 »
If the car was aluminium, it was not built in South Africa. Exactly where the body was made is another issue, but the car was finished in Las Vegas.
   
   Amusing how the difference between the (genuine!) AC Cobra and the MkIV splits people into two camps. When it comes to driving them, you either love one or the other but rarely both. Apart from neanderthals like me who'll drive anything with a V8...

Mark IV

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« Reply #37 on: January 11, 2007, 12:16:14 »
Quote
Originally posted by Emmanueld
   
 I saw and drove one of those new Shelby's made in South Africa I presume, it was an aluminum car and the workmanship was dismal to say the least. [:D]
Quote

   
   If the workmanship was "dismal" it was NOT from South Africa![:0] Anyone who has seen what Hi-Tech builds (Superformance, Noble, GT40, Speedway Motors 32 Ford, etc.) knows that neither the old AC nor Shelby ever dreamed of quality and finish such as they provide.
   And as Trevor mentioned Hi-Tech does not provide alloy bodys to Shelby (although they HAVE built aluminum bodies, both for Cobras and the AC Brooklands Ace/Aceca range)
   
   Rick[:)]

jbottini

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« Reply #38 on: January 11, 2007, 15:17:52 »
The Mark IV was not ment to be a 289. Your comparison here is only good to the proximaty to the 289's CID. The body and frame is clearly that of a 427, 4" tube etc. Animated conversations are fine, but get the facts right. Your car may not have been the best example Emmanual, but after many years of "toys" , not all are perfect; even when they leave the factory. While goood conversation is always welcome, arguing or dispariging for its' own sake is a waste. Have a nice day.

Emmanueld

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« Reply #39 on: January 11, 2007, 17:08:50 »
By the way, when I referred to the AC 289, I did not mean the MKII Cobra, I referred to the AC289 (COB cars) which were build by AC on a 427 chassis in the late 60's , narrow fenders, small block motor and not sold in the US. The Shelby I am talking about was an unpainted aluminum continuation car, panel fit was horrible, the gap between doors, hood was uneven, the amount of work required to paint it and make it look good would be high! The way the gas tank was mounted in the rear was horrible! I am trying to be as unbiased as possible, I have had many cars of all sort and I can tell nice workmanship when I see it. Actually, later Autocrafts are well built, with good panel fit, nice interior, they are just not a real Cobra for me, too civilized!
   
   Emmanuel

cobham cobra

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« Reply #40 on: January 11, 2007, 18:52:56 »
Quote
Originally posted by cobham cobra
   
Quote
Originally posted by Emmanueld
   

   
   
   Emmanueld quote "By the way, before I forget! who cares if it's an Autocraft, Kirkham or even a Shelby! they are all replicas! [:D]"
   
   
   Hi Emmanueld,
   If I owned a replica I could understand your view, but I own an AK MkIV and I don't consider it to be a replica. As we all know Autokraft and Ford acquired AC and Brian A subsequently bought out Ford. So the MkIV was built by a company that either was licensed by AC or owned part of or all of AC. I view the model as a late twentieth century continuation or evolution of a 60's icon. To me the Kirkham successfully attempts to build a point perfect recreation of the 60's original, but it has no connection or lineage with AC cars. In the UK the Kirkham is (a little) cheaper that an average MkIV while I think a good MkIV or Lightweight traded in the UK last year at between $110K and $140k.
   I love classic cars and my cars historical connections have value to me. I live in Surrey, 3 miles from Brooklands where my car was built and about 12 miles from Thames Ditton. I am lucky to be surrounded by AC craftsmen, some of the people that work on my car have been involved with AC for 20 or 30 years. My car was built within the grounds of the historic Brooklands race track, the first purpose build race track in the world http://www.brooklands.org.uk/intro.htm or http://www2.mercedes-benz.co.uk/content/unitedkingdom/mpc/mpc_unitedkingdom_website/en/home_mpc/MB_World_Brooklands.html (click on "why brooklands" worth a look)[8)].
   I may be a little "over the top" in my view and I guess if I lived near a MIG factory in Poland I would see things differently [;)].
   John.
   Grabs coat and leaves.......Check please [:D]

Emmanueld

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« Reply #41 on: January 11, 2007, 22:05:50 »
John, I guess I have a different viewpoint, I buy a car to drive it and I don't care where it comes from to a point. You Have similar views as the Shelby people over here who say that even COB cars are not real Cobras because they did not pass through Shelby's hands. The facts are that MKIV don't have very good resale value in the US and that even COB cars retail for much less than original Shelbys'. You can put my Kirkham next to an original 427 and I defy anybody to tell which one is the real one and which one is the reproduction (Minus the Serial Number ofcourse). Even the instruments are originals not copies, and the motor is a proper 427 side oiler. The cost of my car is 10% of the cost of an original, A proper 427SC will sell for a million bucks over here now and I get the same sensation when I drive it! If I wreck it I won't cry as much and I have all the parts to repair it! I also have a Frua and all the Kirkham chassis parts bolt on perfectly.
   
   Emmanuel

jbottini

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« Reply #42 on: January 12, 2007, 00:39:47 »
Emmanueld, if you are now done trashing the line of this venerable company and obviously don't like them..why not move to clubcobra? Over and out

ak1234

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« Reply #43 on: January 12, 2007, 01:31:56 »
Arent we all car enthusiasts ??  with the same car ... thrashing of which car is closer to the original, is crazy .. I think the MKIV was marketed towards the person who wanted to drive a cobra in everyday and not have to overheat in traffic and a 427 Kirkham is marketed towards the person who cant afford the original.
   
   There is a similiar arugument on the Pantera site .. where they state its a cheap mans ferrari ??  The Pantera group is an excelent bunch of people.
   
   
   I can say, I dont get the whole purpose of thrashing one car or the other.  I have have my likes and dislikes of every version of the Cobra kit replica and .. yes the Original.  Each version of this car is marketed towards a different customer.

dkp_cobra

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« Reply #44 on: January 12, 2007, 07:29:45 »
quote:
Originally posted by Emmanueld
   
John, I guess I have a different viewpoint, I buy a car to drive it and I don't care where it comes from to a point. You Have similar views as the Shelby people over here who say that even COB cars are not real Cobras because they did not pass through Shelby's hands. The facts are that MKIV don't have very good resale value in the US and that even COB cars retail for much less than original Shelbys'. You can put my Kirkham next to an original 427 and I defy anybody to tell which one is the real one and which one is the reproduction (Minus the Serial Number ofcourse). Even the instruments are originals not copies, and the motor is a proper 427 side oiler. The cost of my car is 10% of the cost of an original, A proper 427SC will sell for a million bucks over here now and I get the same sensation when I drive it! If I wreck it I won't cry as much and I have all the parts to repair it! I also have a Frua and all the Kirkham chassis parts bolt on perfectly.
   
   Emmanuel
   

   
   Hi Emmanuel,
   
   I think that your opinion about a MKIV is a logical consequence from your viewpoint about the usage of a cobra. You want to drive it and it should behave like a "original", i.e. a Shelby cobra.
   
   I started my cobra hobby with the sentence "it should look like a cobra, performance is not so important". Well, after some years of recreation of a kit-car my opinion is different. Now, I think performance is still not so important as long as you have enough, but what is much more important to me is history. Is there a "story" associated with my car which I can tell everybody who ask me "what kind of car is this".
   
   Today, I would drive a Triumph TR6 if I don't have the money for a MKIV before I would spend my money on a kit-car. I know that views are different, especially in europe and USA. I am always astonished about the low prices of MKIV in USA. As someone said before the are much higher here in europe. I believe the reason for that is that in USA most of the people who are interested in cobras distinguish cobras in two classes: cobras made by Shelby and the rest. In europe also this distinction is made but in the way: cobras made by AC and the rest. Well, this is course quite generalised but I think it points in the right direction. Please correct me if I am totally wrong (and apologize my bad english, I would like to say that I am still learning but the truth is that I am much better in programming than in foreign language)
   
   Regards, Peter