AC 428 for sale - Hurst Park

[Classicus]

http://www.hurstpark.co.uk/current.htm
   
   
   
   

[cliffordl]

Any idea of the chassis number and asking price? The JD Classics car went fairly quickly - anyone know if the £95,000 convertible at Oldtimer has sold yet?

[nikbj68]

This car & the ex-John Atkins Cobra were at the ACOC 60th Anniversary, but didn`t actually have for sale signs in evidence...If I`d known it was for sale I would have made enquiries on CLassicus` behalf...

[Classicus]

quote:Originally posted by cliffordl
   
Any idea of the chassis number and asking price? The JD Classics car went fairly quickly - anyone know if the £95,000 convertible at Oldtimer has sold yet?

   Apparently the JD Classics one CF 12 went for £120k (which seems incredibly high !), however the Oldtimer one is still for sale.
   
   http://www.jdclassics.co.uk/cars/ac--428

[Classicus]

Hurst Park's 428, CF 48, also just sold for £25k though sounds like some work's needed.
   
   http://www.carandclassic.co.uk/car/C101607?pt=pf

[nikbj68]

quote:Originally posted by Classicus
   
Hurst Park's 428, CF 48, also just sold for £25k though sounds like some work's needed.
   
   http://www.carandclassic.co.uk/car/C101607?pt=pf
   

   
   I don`t believe it!
   
   
   £25k must be a misprint, even if everything needed replacing! Hard to tell from the JD Classics blurry pics, but although the convertible looks good, £120k seems a little rich too!

[cf24]

I know that I have a vested interest BUT on what basis is £120k steep for the JD Classics car ?

[Classicus]

Interesting. Subjectively speaking and my own personal view (!!), £120k is hopefully just the start of a long and sustained rise, more than justified too if it keeps as many as possible on the road, because recognition is now long overdue as the result of so many years of being left in obscurity. Though how and why such obscurity ever arose in the first place for such a great classic I’ve never understood at all, especially when one or two 428s were even being converted into Cobra replicas to try to make a quick profit.
   
   Objectively. Thinking back to the £25k - £60k average figures achieved last year (2008), the convertible always slightly higher, then the approx. £20k - £45k max. that's been roughly the norm depending on condition since I would guess the early Nineties, £120k by comparison certainly is a big percentage jump in one year.
   
   Finally and presumably looking at it the way the general world market and those non enthusiasts just seeing the 428 as yet another classic might now view it all ? There's been three cars that have been sold or are still on sale this year. CF 48 fastback "with some scope for improvement when desired" just sold at £25k; CF 78 convertible still on sale after several months at £95k, and JD Classics' convertible CF 12 also sold recently for apparently £120k. My guess is that a lot of these people could well think that £120k by comparison in view of the prices achieved for 428's over the past few years is pretty steep.
   
   Depends which viewpoint you take I reckon []

[cf24]

Hi Classicus ,
   
   I think that values depend on skilful exposure to the public and to their subsequent desirabilty . That then transferred to dealers marketing the cars a a percieved value .
   
   I know the JD Classics car , and it was a nice car which I think was purchased at Goodwood for about £80k.  This therefore was the bidders view of the value on that day .
   
   JD then having decided that £120k was more correct , and presumably their buyer also agreed .
   
   I think that what irks people is , that at auction , people know what dealers paid for the car that they are now retailing at a different value and vast profit.
   
   The £95k car has not photgraphed well and to me does not look that desirable( those black wheels - Argh!!!!).
   
   At the end of the day , there are only a few cars in existence , and if a buyer really wants the car , then they have to pay what the seller demands - or find another equally desirable car .
   
   PS
   
   Why have Aces shot up so rapidly over the past 2 years?
   
   Does anybody remember the Citroen DS convertible . At one time their value was about £35k , then somebody at auction decided that £90k was the right price , and as far as I know, that is the current market value.

[Classicus]

I think you might have already mentioned this above, but there's one other very important wildcard when considering the 428 and that will always be its enormous rarity; and just the same as with any other rare and beautiful object, especially where beauty is in the eye of the beholder and in such cases the main motivation to buy, how this will affect future values is anyone's guess. In passing was this  your main reason to buy too ?
   
   Another thought, perhaps rarity might have had something to do with its original obscurity ?
   
   Remember the DS convertible well which was quite rare at the time as well though to me they're sssso way overvalued !
   
   As for those black wheels ugh yes – they're horrible as they pull the eye down immediately ! Which are the best from a looks point of view ? Chrome wires, minilites or anything else ? I prefer the highest number of wires myself.
   
   Good to be nice and subjective for a while !! []

[cf24]

Yes , the look and rarity was a major reason AND I valued them at more than the market .
   
   Wires are certainly much more attractive on the car .
   
   Does anybody know who actually bought the JD car , I think it was at Goodwood a few months ago ,on alloy wheels ,  but have not seen it recorded as a new member in ACtion.
   
   Regarding the DS , a similar situation in as much as that I would not buy one at the current price , but the market disagrees , and because I would not buy one at that price does not mean that they are  overvalued !!!!

[davidhickman]

Hi all,
   Been away for a while but I keep looking and saw this one - also a ghastly purple 289.
   
   It's abit awkward with dealers because they are obviously there to make the biggest raid on one's wallet that they can.  Hence, not just with AC's but other others of it's ilk as well, they will often buy cheap ahead of a real enthusiast and then sell it on for a greatly inflated price to a celebrity for lottery money which is a shame as it then rarely understood and therefore rarely looked after properly. Chris Evans and a Ferrari 275 spring to mind.
   
   I recall an Aston which sold at auction about two years ago for 16,000 which, with a hoover out and polish, sold again within the month for 44,950. Nice work... I would have been seething if I'd been at all interested in that one. But I'm not sure dealers and celebrities really make the price of vehicles like that - in most cases value has to be underpinned by the rest of us and what WE are prepared to pay.  So you may get the odd instance where a sale massively breaks the tone of values because the buyer is acting without full knowledge. My view is that realistically we are still looking at price band of £25 to £50 depending on condition. (At least that's my hope!)
   
   Lastly in any make of vehicle one can spend a fortune on a nut and bolt restoration but no matter how good it is the vehicle invariably sells for way less than cost of the restoration. Now if I come across one of those in some one's garage and they want to get shot of it and haven't seen JD's website then I wouldn't leave until I'd clinched a deal )
   Until then I've three other classics that keep me busy... a 428 would make such a lovely mistress though - big sigh

[nikbj68]

Good points well made, David.
   You could add to the reasons one would spend over the odds on a car being personal significance of the car in question, a 'must have it at all costs' reason that may elude the onlooker.
   I think your price band of £25k - £50k is a bit on the stingy side, (NOT if you are trying to buy, of course!!!)
   but Chris Evans` ludicrous, over-double-estimate bid for that (admitteldy nice) Ferrari 250 GT was just silly. I think he was just showing off. UNLESS he is a VERY big fan of James Coburn. VERY VERY big fan.

[cf24]

Surely the Chris Evans bid on the Ferrari is totally misunderstood .
   
   He did not buy that car at that figure without beating a rival bidder !!!!
   
   Secondly , what an enthusiast is prepared to pay is irrelevant - as I keep saying, it needs both a willing buyer and a willing seller to come to an agreement regarding price and hence the market value .

[nikbj68]

Absolutely true, Ken. It defies logic sometimes, but hey, that`s why we love these old and unusual cars, rather than just getting from A to B by whatever means available!
   I suppose the problem arises when one vehicle, (and the Coburn Ferrari is a good case in point) sets a precedent, rather than being viewed as an individual occurence, thereby leading to a "Ferrari 250 GT`s ARE worth £5.5M" rather than "THAT 250 GT was £5.5M..." scenario. But it is human nature, isn`t it? If that one was £5.5M, I want £5.5M for mine...
   LOL... Mine...not in this lifetime!!!
   
   Oh well...back to reality!