Messages

316

Cobra (Thames Ditton) Forum / COB 6101 ?

« on: January 01, 2012, 18:01:02 »

Uwe,
   
   Were you an ACOC member the answer would be but a keystroke away. The Club’s website shows two ‘6101’s; the original car registered MPD 170 D, owned for 41 years by the Corn family & now in the hands of Melvyn Sanders, and the other shown in the Replica Appendix as:
   
   ‘Built 1992. Colour brown. Last known owner Stephan Kranz. Location Germany. Thought to have been built by Brian Angliss. LHD. 427 replica....etc’
   
   You’ll find the website Appendix, listing 22 replica coil spring and 26 replica leaf spring cobras with details of their origin, an interesting read. Finally, rest assured that Rinsey’s books are superbly reliable: the cars you see in them are the real thing.

317

Ace, Aceca & Greyhound Forum / 2.6 Ace replica for sale

« on: December 28, 2011, 16:57:02 »

Club registers, covering 1910 to 2001, have no record of this chassis number and it’s not in any known AC or standard VIN format.
   KDF 616, a 1951 Gloucestershire registration, precedes Ruddspeed Aces by ten years.  I wonder what the V5C shows?

318

Ace, Aceca & Greyhound Forum / 2.6 Ace replica for sale

« on: December 27, 2011, 20:48:05 »

'Chassis Number: RM28771100596....a period AC chassis number...'
   
   Maybe Coy's cataloger has inside information.

319

Cobra (Thames Ditton) Forum / Worm & Sector woes

« on: November 26, 2011, 17:49:50 »

Although using a worm and sector car for twenty years (2042) I haven’t heard of different worms for the Bishop steering box. The Ace used the same box, and you might want to try a few Ace specialists.
   
   A-Snake’s terminology is absolutely correct. As a minor bit of history, an AC period advert for the coil-spring car called the leaf-spring model (all 654 cars) the Mk I.

320

General Forum / Register for Later Vehicles

« on: November 09, 2011, 11:36:41 »

The ACOC Register is only for vehicles made by AC. If the Council receives an application for a vehicle built by another constructor using significant parts manufactured by AC, it will be listed in an appendix.
   
   This is like the current Register appendix ‘Period Cobras Built by Other Constructors’ (to be loaded on the website shortly) listing HEM 6, CSX 2131 and CS 2131A (constructors: High Efficiency Motors, Willment, and Willment and Unknown Parties).
   
   Thus a Factory Five Cobra would not appear in the Appendix.
   
   The Club’s procedure for those who apply for a more recent AC made vehicle to be registered is set out in December ACtion. If anyone would like an AC made vehicle registered, please apply to any member of the Council with the normal register information (VIN, date sold by AC, current owner etc) and supporting copy documentary information (V5C or other registration document, invoices etc).

[Cobra Fifty]

321

General Forum / Cobra 50th Anniversary 2012 - Ideas for Event??

« on: September 20, 2011, 10:24:22 »

As with the recent Düsseldorf (ACtion pages 26-30) and Sparkford gatherings, Cobra Fifty is an invitation-only event supported by the Club but not organised by the ACOC. All owners of Thames Ditton Cobras and family members will be invited to attend with their cars.
   
   The Club is exploring a 50th anniversary proposal to have a Cobra-only race at UK circuit, but hasn’t yet received any other suggestions from members who offer to carry their proposals forward. The Club always supports member proposals, provided they promote the preservation and enjoyment of cars built by AC and don’t put Club funds to excess risk.

322

General Forum / Cobra 50th Anniversary 2012 - Ideas for Event??

« on: September 14, 2011, 21:26:04 »

England is in Northern Europe

The Committee is anxious to make the three-day event as accessible to as many period cobra owners as possible. These include owners in Belgium, Denmark, France, Germany, Holland, Sweden and Switzerland, who collectively own the majority of period cobras in Europe

The size of the event is restricted by the availability of appropriate hotels

All prior experience leads to a single conclusion: the aim, the greatest number of period cobras, will only be achieved by restricting the event to period cobras. This is true both of the UK (the 2007 Sparkford event) and Continental Europe (see ACtion pages 26 to 30.

   
   I will set up a separate thread on the Thames Ditton Cobra Forum shortly, when the date and location has been finalise by the Organising Committee.
   
   The Council always welcomes event suggestions from members prepared to organise them. Constant advice to others without volunteering any personal action is wearing.

[Ace, Aceca & Greyhound]

323

Cobra (Thames Ditton) Forum / Registration Number JSK 867

« on: September 05, 2011, 10:24:12 »

Kindly follow the Forum structure by using the Ace, Aceca & Greyhound Forum for Ace matters. This car is not a Thames Ditton cobra.
   
   Robin Stainer

324

General Forum / Definition of 'Continuation'

« on: August 16, 2011, 21:28:11 »

Gus,
   
   A conflict would arise if a registrar has a business interest in the type of vehicle in question.
   
   The principal call on my time as registrar is the examination of vehicle documentation and physical inspection attendance at dealer and owner premises. Close liaison with my US SAAC counterpart also takes time.
   
   Most of the vehicles in question are in Europe, principally in the UK; further, existing SAAC contacts can deal with all continuation cobra issues that require US physical inspection. A UK presence is therefore an advantage. Some legal grounding and the ability to attend register entry appeals at Council meetings also helps.
   
   RS

325

General Forum / Definition of 'Continuation'

« on: August 16, 2011, 13:22:15 »

The Club would welcome any volunteers to act as registrar for more recent AC vehicles. Volunteers need to:

Have substantial knowledge of the vehicle type

Have no potential conflict of interest

Be a Club member

Maintain the Register in accordance with principles (vehicle definition, categorisation etc) agreed with the Council.

   
   Until we have such a volunteer (who should contact a Council member) it may be better to put the topic of further registers into abeyance .

[not include replicas]

326

General Forum / Definition of 'Continuation'

« on: August 15, 2011, 18:26:06 »

Nick,
   
   Two points.
   
   Firstly, from the  'classification' or 'categorisation' point of view it is necessary to distinguish between (a)the technical characteristics of a vehicle, (b) the manufacturer of the vehicle and (c) the brand of the vehicle. Any other approach becomes very complicated. Any classification system needs, for example, to deal with the 50,000+ cobras unambiguously.
   
   Secondly, the Thames Ditton Cobra Register does not include replicas. The Appendix replica list is to avoid confusion with period ACs.
   
   The Appendix lists all known Thames Ditton cobra replicas in Europe. A replica is defined as a car:
   

not built by AC in Thames Ditton

not built in period

which is held to be a period cobra

has the approximate specification of a Thames Ditton Cobra

has an AC or AC-like car number.

   
   RS

327

General Forum / Definition of 'Continuation'

« on: August 15, 2011, 15:06:26 »

Does the ACOC have a definition of a continuation car? No, but this is from a 2001 ACtion article that categorised all the 50,000+ cobras constructed worldwide:
   
   "Continuation cars are vehicles built to similar specification to Thames Ditton cobras. Built in volume from the 80s (firstly by Autokraft), most have improvements to the original design to increase reliability, enhance comfort, simplify manufacture and meet more stringent regulatory needs. One can debate the de-minimis definition but I suggest the following:

The external appearance of a cobra

A tubular ladder chassis

A V8 engine.

   
   Continuation cars, in economy-dependant annual volumes, continue to be built by several constructors including:

AC (in its current incarnation)

Shelby American

Kirkham

Superformance."

[clone]

328

Cobra (Thames Ditton) Forum / CSX 2358 Caveat Emptor?

« on: August 09, 2011, 18:56:38 »

The car for sale in the UK is the clone, listed in the ACOC Register as a Replica. SAWR's ‘clone’ categorization followed an inspection concluding 'it was not the legitimate CSX2358'.
   
   The last known owner of the original is Allen Pankopf Ford, PA, USA in 1964. The ACOC believes this car to be destroyed, on the ground that it is statistically very unlikely that a Cobra unseen and unknown of for forty five years will emerge.
   
   The SAAC is right to appeal for further information following the anonymous report it received some five years ago; the appeal's lack of response would appear to endorse the 'believed destroyed' conclusion.
   
   RS

329

Cobra (Thames Ditton) Forum / CSX 2358 Caveat Emptor?

« on: August 08, 2011, 20:23:48 »

A-Snake,
   
   I think I meant five. I wasn't counting:
   

The footbox tag ('chassis plate' to Euro readers) as it's not the body/chassis unit

Engraved VINs (normally two).

   
   Perhaps I should have said eight?
   
   R

330

Cobra (Thames Ditton) Forum / CSX 2358 Caveat Emptor?

« on: August 08, 2011, 12:28:31 »

This car is a replica first seen in 2001. See Thames Ditton Cobra Register (for the original) and replica leaf spring cobra Appendix (for the replica).
   
   The last known owner of the Thames Ditton 2358 as a continuous history vehicle is Allen Pankopf Ford, PA, USA, in 1964. This vehicle is believed destroyed in the 60s.
   
   The car that appeared in 2001 has features and absence of history indicating that it is not a Thames Ditton cobra. The evidence includes:
   ƒ{    ¡¥An inspection of the vehicle revealed that its primary and secondary VIN-stampings were incorrect or missing altogether. Its footbox identification tag was a reproduction with incorrect stampings and an incorrect engine number; and various features of the car-including the footboxes, pedals, pedal box, hood prop-rod, leaf springs, steering column geometry, dashboard, gauges, door hinges, inner panels, and engine bay layout-all indicated it was not the legitimate CSX2358.¡¦ [SAAC SAWR 4th edition pages 221 & 222, this public domain information being readily available.]
   ƒ{   The absence of authoritative record of 2358¡¦s existence for a thirty five year period (1965 to 2000). [To be classified as existing now a car must have continuous history as a complete vehicle since manufacture.]
   ƒ{   The car exchanges hands at a price much below a Thames Ditton cobra in similar state of repair.
   ƒ{   The recent authoritative statement that the car¡¦s body/chassis unit has no VIN stampings. [A Thames Ditton cobra has VIN stampings in five separate places.]
   
   The message is (a) research cars by examining authoritative sources and (b) caveat emptor.