AC Owners Club Forum
AC Owners Club Forum => Ace, Aceca & Greyhound Forum => Topic started by: James Eastwood on July 02, 2018, 14:27:47
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Hi there gents.
My brakes had these components in them, two anti rattle spring things, with mounting pieces and one larger aluminium cover over the whole assembly. Pic attached.
What do other owners use in this area and where do you get the replacement parts please? Is the aluminium cover a racing part for additional pad retension or a factory part?
I did do a search but nothing came up, possibly the parts are known by different names.
James
BE475
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Hi James,
These parts are standart items on the callipers of TR 3. You should be able to find them at any TR dealer! Hope this helps.
By the way - does anyone know about the original equipment of clutch master and slave for my Aceca? They didn't come with the car and I'm looking for the right things.
Chris
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Very cool, found them listed under TR3.
If anyone can share information on the larger aluminiumplate that would be helpful. What exactly is it's function and is a factory part or a period modification?
James
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Clutch master; Girling 3/4 no part number visible.
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Clutch slave; Girling 7/8 part number looks like HO 5687 although the '5' is not super clear.
My car is Bristol with Moss gearbox and is conveniently on axle stands at present!
James
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Hi James
Can't speak for your Aceca, but my 1961 Ace 2.6 has had this alloy cover ever since I bought it in 1971, so I assume it is original.
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Good evening,
Here are the clutch master & slave cylinders that were on my Ace Bristol until last year when I replaced them. They seem to be the same as on James' car.
I believe the master cylinder as fitted from new at the factory originally came with an aluminium cap instead of the disgracious but probably more convenient plastic unit introduced Lord knows when.
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Hi gents,
thank you all so much! more information for me than for James 8)
Well, in fact I don't know the great aluminium caps from my cars and I cannot see a reason exept of dirt prevention? Maybe someone thought to keep water away from the gap between friction pad and disc? I prefer to have air for cooling in this area.
Thanks again and happy motoring,
Chris
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Hello,
For comparison's sake here is how the cover plate looks like on mine.
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Thank you. I think perhaps the black paint is original as my plate was also that colour.
Due to only having one, I fabricate a second part. To match the original I used a piece of ally cut from a large second hand sheet we have of 1950's allumium that came from the workshop of none other than Colin Crabbe!
I very much like the idea of using period material to make a period repair. Anyhow see if you can tell the original from the 'new' part!
James
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The lower one is the 'new part', correct? :)
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From his post, I'm worried that AE501 might be tempted to run the car without the alloy plate. The brakes would work, but if an anti-rattle spring fatigued and broke (not inconceivable, they are not very substantial) there's nothing to keep the pads in place. The result could be nasty.
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Norman from the replies so far, I think we're still not quite sure what the purpose of the plate is exactly. It is perhaps unlikely to be for extra retention as I originally thought as it has about a 2mm clearance over the spring retainer plates. It's not a feature on TRs that use a similar caliper.
IMO - I think you're probably ok without it.
James
NB - yes, dkp_cobra the near plate is the modern 'period material' reproduction!
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I am just working on my front brake calipers and I also have these aluminium covers. They are not Triumph TR3 parts. I don't know the TR3 in detail. Where is the caliper mounted? Does it points to the front or to the back of the car?
I guess the purpose of these covers is to prevent little stones swirling by the tires jumping into the caliper and jamming between rotor and brake pad. This happens quite rarely but if it happens it makes an awful noise and destroys the rotor.
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The answer is; TR3s have the steering rack in front of the front axle centre line, thus the calliper is behind the centre line (facing backwards), because the norm on an suspension upright is that the calliper and steering arm are on different sides, forward/backward.
Which brings us on a very interesting observation (imo), which is that the Ace is somewhat unusual for a front-engine-rear-drive sports car in that the rack/steering arms are behind the axle centre line. Whereas other vehicles such as TRs, Healy Sprite & 3000, MG Y type A & B have the steering arrangement in front of the axle CL. The Ace architecture locks the design into a very rearward engine position. I wonder therefore whether this was driven by the choice of the front suspension uprights, were the uprights borrowed from another vehicle?
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James,
The Front Upright B60125/6 was an A.C. part. I rather think that the engine position in the chassis was determined by John Tojeiro to give 50/50 weight distribution rather than to avoid the steering idler which is the most aft part of the Bishop Cam steering arrangement. No rack on an Ace of course. The other point to remember is that the design is for drum brakes and that the caliper and caliper carrier were a later adaptation.
It is certainly the case that mounting a steering box behind the front axle centre line is inherently much safer than extending the steering column in front of the axle, however whether or not A.C. had this in mind when redesigning Tojeiro's steering is another mystery...
The question on caliper dust covers and retainers for the Type B calipers, as fitted to Ace and Aceca is straightforward: The pads are retained by two triangular plates which mount on the little studs which appear at top and bottom of the pad access aperture. The plates are aligned by having a small tab, at their peak, turned over at 90° which enter in to a blind hole in the caliper, just above the mounting stud. Beneath these retaining plates could be fitted a convoluted spring steel plate which was to prevent the pads rattling. Above the retaining plates an A.C. supplied aluminium plate could be fitted. The whole 'sandwich' was retained by plain nuts and shakeproof washers. The Girling illustration on their Ace / Aceca Service Bulletin shews the retaing plate and anti rattle spring, but no dust shield. The anti rattle springs and dust shield were geneally discarded for competition and, if not, they seemed to corrode and drop off anyway.
All of this will be academic on many an Ace and Aceca as, even in period, the Type B caliper was being superseded and alternative Girling calipers are to be found fitted to many cars today. I will try and add a scan of the Girling Service Bulletin later, but first one has to sort out the HP printing and scanning programme which has been disabled by reason of the demise of 'Flash' player. A grand waste of time....
Barrie
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Here we are, after much fighting with the lap top and printer, the Girling disc brake Service Bulletin:
(https://i.postimg.cc/0QKM3rM7/Giling-Service-Bulletin-Ace-Aceca.jpg)
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There's a full version of this on the Members' Area of the website:
Members' Area -> Model Directory - > Ace -> Articles -> Ace and Aceca Brake Servicing
I'll replace it at some stage as it's one of the early scans without page breaks which doesn't make printing easy.
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Thanks Barry, I missed your reply when you wrote it. I've taken a copy of your scan for my file.