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Messages - strada5300

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16
428 Frua Forum / Still wielding the paintbrush, here's Gurney '64
« on: April 05, 2009, 01:50:52 »
I don't know enough about computers to transfer an image. I always thought the Cobra effort in the '64 Targa was laudable but lamentable (Shelby didn't count on how rough the roads were though he had driven the Targa himself years earlier). I had this old publicity picture for 40 plus years, but only thought of doing a painting once I got the blue color right If anyone knows how to transfer it from this website
   to this forum, feel free
   http://www.velocetoday.com/wallace-a-wyss-ephemera
   
   Incidentally I thought I saw this same car which I reckon was CSX2323,  at the Cars 'n Coffee meet in Irvine,CA a few months ago but it was early in the a.m and wasn't quick enough to shoot a picture of the CSX plate. I know one company makes a replica albeit with a 5-speed manual. Dan Gurney was there and posed by it so maybe it was the real thing....

17
428 Frua Forum / The first, er, second Cobra
« on: March 31, 2009, 21:40:43 »
Last Sunday I  saw CSX2001 in person. This is a significant sighting for me, a guy who has researched Cobras for 40 plus years. It is the subject of a 5-page article in Vintage Motorsport, an American magazine. The way I understand it, this car never saw the Shelby plant but went from the UK to Pittsburgh to be prepared for racing. It never had a set of side vents installed though it was updated to a 289. Originally it was a street car but was prepared for competition and ran in European events under the ownership of several different Frenchmen. I was thinking of writing a story about its history myself but was wondering about a couple things: the hardtop it used in Europe that had a side profile like a 250LM roof, was that aluminum? Was there only that one made? Did it have an inset rear window like a 250LM (the picture I have is front 3/4 view).
      Also the rear flares bulge out instead of having a fender lip to cover the tyre, has anyone else seen rear fender arches like that on a small block other than a FIA 289?
      The article in Vintage Motorsport playfully hints that this could be the first Cobra, though Shelby says the one he has, CSX2000, is the first one. Shelby's has inboard rear brakes, the only such car built.
      Here's the only picture I could find on the net
   http://www.edgar-motorsport.com/id1.html
   but if anyone has pictures they shot of it in its previous liveries during its race career, I can trade images I shot last week at one of those informal cars 'n coffee for those.
      By the way, I consider my tastes in Cobras maturing as I am weaned away from the raw untamed King-of-the-Known-World power of the 427 and coming to appreciate the 289s....

18
428 Frua Forum / Does anyone know current status CSX2166?
« on: March 14, 2009, 22:43:45 »
bitzman
   Registered User
      Join Date: Apr 2005
   Posts: 395
   Rep Power: 5
   
   
   Current status of CSX2166?
   
   --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
   
   As I prepared to research a car to see if it was sufficiently significant in Cobra history to justify making a painting, I noticed that the status of the car is still muddled (yes, I don' t have the new SAAC Register, I don't even have the old one).
   I speak of the Ferrari GTO hood vent-car, CSX2166. Here's what I know about it so far.
   
   I tried to follow the tangled tale of CSX2166 but got lost on the curves. Does anyone know if it's been proved that the Daytona coupe replica running this chassis number in Europe is really the prototype test car from 1964? I guess the confusion results from someone wrote down 2196 as the chassis number at some point and from that point on the two cars always get confused. Here's what I found out so far, like to hear anyone's "proof" of what happened to it after Sebring in' 64---------------------------------------------------
   
   A Potted History of The Leaf Sprung Big Block “GTO breathing vents” Cobra
   
   There was one small block Cobra that ran with a big block and Ferrari 250GTO style air intakes. It was CSX2166, raced at Sebring, March 21, 1964 with John Morton driving. The car came about when Ken Miles, as Shelby’s chief engineer, had a discussion with the Hurlock brothers who owned A.C. Cars Ltd., Shelby’s supplier, and decided to see if Ford’s 390 aluminum block would fit and how the leaf sprung car would perform in racing conditions. The car was cobbled together. Ironically the car hit a tree in practice with Miles at the wheel. What a tree was doing on a race course takes too much explaining. Suffice to say the car was near uncontrollable. Miles stayed up all night long pounding the car out so it would be race ready the next day.
   
   Though I have seen pictures of him in the forughly repaired car I think he must have turned it over early to Morton and gone off to tend his cracked or broken ribs (which he had taped up after the crash). Morton only lasted a few laps before the engine blew.
   
   According to the website http://www.sandcastlevi.com/racing/cobra-1.htm here are the Cobras that ran at Sebring in 1966
   
   1 GT D.MacDonald/B.Holbert 10 Cobra Daytona CSX2287 CS
   2 GT B.Bondurant/L.Spencer 12 Cobra Roadster ******* CS
   3 GT J.Schlesser/P.Hill 14 Cobra Roadster ******* CS
   5 GT S.Scott/H.Keck 80 Cobra Roadster CSX2127 Cust.
   6 GT D.Gurney/B.Johnson 11 Cobra Roadster CSX2259 CS
   7 GT T.Hitchcock/Tchkotoua 15 Cobra Roadster CSX2155 Cust.
   12 GT E.Lowther/Wintersteen 18 Cobra Roadster CSX2153 Cust.
   DNF J.Stevens/Noseda 16 Cobra Roadster CSX2137 Cust.
   DNF Reed/D.Gerber/Lang 19 Cobra Roadster CSX2138 Cust.
   DNF G.Shaw/DeWayne 24 Cobra Roadster CSX2129 Cust.
   DNF K.Miles/J.Morton 1 Cobra 427 CSX2166 CS
   
   I don't know why it is listed as a 427 on this list. At any rate, it must have been resurrected because, as improbable as it seems, it is possible that a historic car like CSX2166 was ignored for its contribution to Cobra history and later fitted out as a street car.The chassis number was last seen on a Swiss auto dealer’s website wearing a Daytona coupe body. The firm called Burgoi.Their e-mail info@burgol.ch. (it's not China, Switzerland is actually The Confederation of Helvetia)
   
   And to the guy who, every time I bring up something historical, always asks why I don't look it up in the Register, I don't take any one source as gospel truth.
   
   I think if this chassis number Cobra still exists, it would be worth more in its 1964 Sebring body style, complete with lumpy post-crash body and aluminum block 390 (must be rare on the ground...John Vermeersch might know. He's at Total Preformance , 44020 N. Groesbeck Hwy. , Mt. Clemens, MI 49043, 313/468-3673) Of course it still might be uncontrollable..but, hey, isn't that what authenticity is all about?

19
428 Frua Forum / Real Daytona coupe coming up for sale
« on: March 07, 2009, 02:03:26 »
What’s the most expensive Cobra ever sold?
   
   Clue no. 1: It could be this Daytona coupe
   
   by Wallace Alfred Wyss
   
   
   "Cobramania" is not dead. At least not yet.
   
   According to Lance Coren, a specialist high performance car appraiser in Prather, CA, who used to actually co-own a Cobra restoration shop in Torrance, CA (a shop still existing under the name McCluskey Ltd.)  the most expensive Cobra ever sold to date could be the one coming up at the 22nd Dana Mecum Original Spring Classic Auction May 13-17 in Indianapolis. It is a 1965 Shelby Daytona Cobra coupe, chassis no.  CSX2601
   
   The coupe, designed by Pete Brock, was one of six coupes built by Carroll Shelby to compete against Ferrari in the F.I.A. (Federation Internationale de l’Automobile) World Manufacturers Championship in the GT race class.
   
    The car is interesting in part because Brock only got begrudging support from the rest of the crew at Shelby-American when he dreamed up the design. The shop crew initially called the car “the slug” but when it proved to be capable of 180 mph in its maiden run at Riverside (which was about 15 mph faster than an open roadster) , the crew decided that the wet-behind-the-ears Brock knew sumpthin’ after all.
   
   
   
   That first prototype went on to run the 1964 Daytona Continental — prompting Shelby to adopt the nickname for the car —  and order five more coupes built, including CSX2601. The remaining five had bodywork built by Carrozzeria Gran Sport in Modena, Italy, ironically a shop in the same town as Shelby’s arch rivals, Ferrari. The first car had been bodied in Los Angeles by a shop downtown.
   
   After competing at Daytona, Monza, Spa and Nürburgring, CSX2601 made history when it helped to clinch the 1965 World Manufacturers Championship for the U.S. and Shelby American on July 4th in Reims, France.
   
   
   
   According to a website called The Car Source the competition record includes eight FIA races in 1965 (Daytona, Sebring, Monza, Spa, Nürburgring, LeMans, Reims, Enna), It won four times in GT III class, at Monza, Nürburgring, Reims, Enna), and at one point or another was  driven by Bob Johnson, Tom Payne, Bob Bondurant, Allen Grant, the German driver Jochen Neerpasch and Jo Schlesser (the latter an outstanding French driver who was killed in an accident at the French Grand Prix in 1968).
   
   At Reims, 3-4 July 1965, the drivers were Bondurant & Schlesser. It was painted Guardsman Blue witth the wide white stripes. They won the GT III Class.  Ironically though Shelby-American claimed the victory and truly deserved it for designing ,  building an developing the car,it is little known among the Yank fans of the Cobras that in ’65 Shelby had handed off running the coupes in Europe to a subcontractor, Alan Mann, who deserves credit for its '65 racing record as well.
   
   The last Cobra Daytona coupe that came up for sale was the infamous first one made, #2287, which at one time belonged to accused murderer/record producer Phil Spector and when re-discovered afer 40 plus years in hiding belonged to a lady who decided to light herself on fire. That car went to a doctor in Pennslyvania named Dr. Simeone who reportedly paid in the neighborhood of $4 million dollars. It was a battered wreck when found in storage and hasn't yet been fully restored. A Cobra that fetched more was the original Super Snake, a 427 side oiler powered Cobra built by Shelby for his own amusement, with twin Paxton superchargers and a Lincoln automatic 3 speed transmission. That went for over $5 million at the Barrett Jackson auction.
   
   Whether this Daytona Cobra coupe will surpass that figure remains to be seen because the U.S. is tottering on sliding into a depression and as they say "all bets may be off."
   
   The Daytona to be sold has been restored and  will be sold live on U.S. national television May 15 during the “Mecum Auto Auction: Muscle Cars & More” series on Discovery Communications’ HD Theater.
   
   “Many vintage race cars have a strong American racing history to share — including this vehicle’s sister car, CSX 2299 — but no car can claim a finer race hour than the Shelby Daytona Cobra coupe CSX2601,” said Dana Mecum, president of Mecum Auction.  (NOTE: The author wishes he knew what "race hour"meant...-Ed.)
   
   Driving the car — and America — to victory on that fateful July afternoon was legendary driver Bob Bondurant.
   
   “I won a lot of races with this Daytona Cobra coupe, but when I crossed the finish line at the Reims race track, I yelled ‘Yes!’  It was a fantastic feeling,” Bondurant said. “I always wanted to race in Europe against the world’s best drivers. Winning that World Championship was the crowning achievement of my career. I think it’s wonderful that the car is being showcased 40 years later.”
   
   Ironically, after their racing careers the Daytona coupes were sold off by Shelby-American as nothing more than derelict race cars. At one point, the American magazine Motor Trend featured a story on a North Dakota businessman with six gas stations who owned this same coupe, each day driving a  300-mile round trip to collect station receipts in his race-trimmed Cobra. I reckon with all that cash, the booty increasing with each station stop,  he needed something fast
   
   The Daytona headlines the Original Spring Classis Auction, which is expected to feature 1,250 vehicles.
   
   Held at the Indiana State Fairgrounds, the auction is open to the general public with tickets are available at the door for $10, or may be seen on HD Theater.
   
   Consignment, bidder, and accommodation information for the Indianapolis event is available online at www.Mecum.com or by calling 815-568-8888.
   
   ---------------------
   Wallace Alfred Wyss is the author of SHELBY The Man, The Cars, The Legend

20
428 Frua Forum / First 427 Cobra prototype, description
« on: February 17, 2009, 22:22:16 »
Hello Cobra fans:
   I am making a painting of the first 427 Cobra when it was being tested at Silverstone in 1965. I have a pretty good reference photo, colour, front 3/4 angle, but can't tell what is happening with the bonnett. It looks like it has a sizable lump to cover  a carburetor but did it also have an opening at the windscreen end or was it just a lump? Also the car still has the smaller grille cavity of the 289 which I gather was on the first two 427 prototypes. The SAAC club in the US says CSX3001 never got a body but CSX3002 did and has been in So. California many years, still with the small grille cavity. So would history buffs agree this has to be CSX3002? The driver wore a red helmet, similar in shape to US football helmet, would that be Chris Amon? Anyone who wants to see the finished painting (which will be available as a print on watercolour paper or canvas) can write me at Photojournalistpro@hotmail.com

21
428 Frua Forum / The first 427 super coupe
« on: December 10, 2008, 22:16:16 »
I was researching the so called "Super coupe" for a story when I realized that the auction company that sold it at Monterey CA was saying at the time of the sale that there were two Super coupes--that after Brock inspected the chassis and its outsize body at Radford,he rejected it for being too far off his measurements, and he ordered another car built on a new chassis  (CSB3054?). I heard the Shelby Museum in Colorado has a second unfinished 427 coupe so I was wondering if that is the abandoned one rejected by Brock or yet another car? I find it hard to believe Radford would have thrown away a 427 chassis...onc ethey peeled off the body, it could have been rebodied as a Cobra roadster.

22
428 Frua Forum / Mystery fans? Name Richard Pierce ring any bells?
« on: December 05, 2008, 03:01:38 »
Maybe I watch too much TV but there's a TV program here in the States called Cold Case and today when I was reading the ACOC Forum a name lept out at me from the past that made me want to dial the LAPD Cold Case lads.  The name was Richard Pierce.
   
   Back in the '70s (those days are extremely vague to me) I met this young hotshot lawyer in an upscale LA suburb called Encino. I was there to sell him car literature but all he wanted to do was show me his two 427 Cobras which he said he had ordered from the UK. He and a Chicago-based partner were paying somebody in LA to redo the interiors to they would be exactly like the Sixties CSX3000 cars and he planned to affix the SN (VIN) of real Cobras that had been crashed or were known to be destroyed.
   
   (Why people want to show me their dishonest schemes I'll never know.)
   
   
    But I digress. Only days after our meeting, Mr. Pierce, in true Los Angeles film noir style, caught a bullet, as they say,  and promptly expired. I never heard if the case was solved, and if so, if a motive was established. It might have had nothing to do with cars. But if it wasn't solved, my question for serial number chasers is:
   
   --did he successfully pass off the cars as originals so that there are five 427 Cobras out there that were from this batch?
   
   --Was there ever any investigation of the car scam in connection with his untimely demise?
   
   In the ACOC forum, what started me down the rabbit hole was a  mention of his and his partner's name in connection with a small block 289. I only saw two big block cars at Mr. Pierce's residence so I perhaps poorly concluded that they were all going to be alike.
   
   I haven't found out if there is a cold case squad in Los Angeles yet but the city is so broke they probably have a solitary individual dusting off the old files....and no doubt he has quite a backlog.

23
428 Frua Forum / New book called SHELBY CARS
« on: July 11, 2008, 03:43:49 »
Out of Arizona, David Bull Publishing. Respected publisher with some pretty authoritative books to date. I will do a book report when I get a copy (maybe there will be some at Monterey in August).

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428 Frua Forum / German book on Cobras
« on: July 02, 2008, 23:55:49 »
Hello
   I finally found the French book on Cobra
   Cobra 260 289 427 by P. hazan
   Since I don't speak French I wonder if any who do thought the book was
   accurate. I think in a couple places he captions a 289 FIA as a 427 Cobra but lots of people can't tell them apart in pictures.
   
   But I also heard there was a German book, maybe only on the 427 Cobra, published by an eccentric guy who also builds his own custom car. Anybody know the title/author/publisher?
   
   Thanks for any info,

25
American historian needs front 3/4 picture and dashboard shots of a "long nose" 2.6 Ace from the Goodwood display in July. Here's the description of the AC focus from a PR release I received today. Anybody who sends me a digital image on a disc, colour slides or old fashioned colour prints. In return, I can send misc. b & w Cobra pics from "back in the day"
   W.Wyss, 6489 Elena Ave. Chino,CA 91710
   --------------------------------------------------------
   GOODWOOD RACES FROM 0-60 IN 850 YEARS
   
   
   
   Dear Motor Sport Enthusiast,
   
   
   
   With just over two weeks to go until the 2008 Festival of Speed gets underway (11-13 July), Goodwood is getting into celebratory mode as it prepares to mark a number of significant motor sport and automotive anniversaries at the event, including Goodwood’s own 60th anniversary since motor racing began at the famous West Sussex venue in 1948. A selection of the many anniversaries being recognised at the 2008 Festival of Speed will include:
   
   
   
   100 Years:
   
   
   
   1908 French GP: For the first time since the famous 1908 French Grand Prix, a record number of the actual cars that competed in that race will be together again at the Festival.
   
   Ian Fleming: Celebrated British author and James Bond creator would have been 100 this year. To mark this fact, we will be gathering a selection of well-known cars used by 007 in various Bond movies as part of the Cartier ‘Style et Luxe.’ Confirmed cars present will include his Aston Martin DB5 with ejector seat from Goldfinger and the Lotus Esprit ‘submarine’ from The Spy Who Loved Me.
   
   AC: The Centenary of AC will be honoured with a display of important models from the ex-Thames Ditton specialist car maker lined-up along the dunhill Driver’s Club ‘Walk of Fame’.
   
   Ford Model T: Production of the Model

26
428 Frua Forum / How many Cobras entirely built in UK
« on: March 13, 2008, 20:35:01 »
I was reading the Nostalgia F1 forum and I came across this about UK market Cobras.
   "127 cars were entirely UK-built of which 50 odd were exported. The first rhd car was delivered to Lord Cross in November 1963 whilst the second, APA 6B, was retained as the factory demonstrator."
   
   I have two questions. Were the 50-odd exported from the UK a mix of RHD and LHD?
   
   Was the number APA 6B the serial number (I would have thought it began with COB) or the registration number (what we Yanks call license plate number?)
   
   Thanks for any illumination,

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