AC Owners Club Forum
AC Owners Club Forum => General Forum => Topic started by: Emmanueld on January 26, 2007, 21:00:12
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I am somewhat disappointed by this forum, I thought we would discuss various technical aspects of AC Cars and instead we end up arguing over kit car value and whether or not the MKIV is a real AC or not. I would like to see more questions and answers about real AC cars like Acecas’, Bristols’, Zephyrs’, Cobras’, 428s’ Etc.
I guess that’s why we don’t hear much from original AC owners, a pity.
[?]
Emmanuel
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maybe if the forum members were constantly provoked, that would happen??
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Maybe we should have a separate forum about kit cars as well! It could be interesting as well!
Emmanuel
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zoom...right over the consious level of some
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LOL .... say it slowly AC OWNERS CLUB .... not replica's and kit cars .. thats CLUB COBRA ..
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AK 1234.
I agree. Plus UK Cobra Club for those this side of the pond.
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Hmmmmmm, what forum contributor has consistently bad mouthed the AC MKIV and tried to equate his kit car to an original AC? Maybe he can post some more photos of his car and try harder to convince other forum members how original it is. Maybe then he'll complain some more about lack of AC content. I think we have encountered the king of trolls! LOL
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hear!! hear!!!!
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Hi
Don,t want to be a KILL JOY !!!! But this is The AC Club web site, Lets discuss ACs and leave AC-rap copy of The Cobra to those unfortuneate souls who cannot play with the real thing.
We can all live together and appreciate each others toys irrespective of being real Ali jobs, Ali / Fibreglass or Carbon copies etc etc.
But SERIOUSLY, all this CRAP on Copies just makes most of us True enthusiast switch off. So lets have serious discussion, serious help to keep our genuine ACs on the road and track.
There are Thousands of cheap Cobra Facsimily Forums out there, use them for cheap entertainment and use the ACOC Forum for what it is intended...... Enjoyment, assistance and networking for the benifit of true enthusiasts wether they be owners or not.
Enough said..... Sorry to go on ...... but I like so many Club Members I have simply had enough of this Diarrhea...
A Disillusioned AC Ace Bristol owner, Who uses his car on Both Road and Track in Europe and UK all year round and has also learnt to share it with his two Sons ( and Julie ).
I better keep a low profile for some weeks, maybe live in the garage and carry out some preventive maintenance. ( Hard hat and thick skin not essential but helpfull whilst in the front line )
Enjoy !!
Keith
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oh yeah, completely agree
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I am sorry if my presence has upset some of you. If you take the time to read the following thread you will see that my first post on it (About no. 14 ish)was by no means trolling but replying with figures as to the cost of a fully built Kirkham.(Something I would like to do)(Costing out kit cars is my job). It all got out of hand when the starter of this thread decided that the kirkham was not a kit. (18th post in this thread:- http://www.racecar.co.uk/acoc/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=228 )
Will someone who he actually respects please tell him that the Kirkham is a kit car for gods sake.
If you want me to go just say and I'm gone. All those in favour say aye etc.
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Dave, you are NOT the problem.
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Dave, my post was not in any way directed at you or your input on this forum. Your insight on the subject at hand was appreciated.
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I am talking about original ACs' not MKIV!! (the real thing). You guys have your own forum!
[:D]
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I'm not dissapointed by this forum ... not sure what your talking about ... matter of fact a number of very knowledgeable members I have spoken to have given me valauble information which I cannot get anywhere else.
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I agree with ak1234. I have found the forum to be an excellent source of info. Before discovering it, I had virtually no access to knowledgeable Ace people. After joining the forum, I have received excellent information from many different people and thank them all. Additionally, I have learned much from other people's posts and am ready for some problems when and if they arise. Thanks to all that have put the forum together and keep it running.
Jay
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I was being facetious, just trying to bring a little dialogue, actually its fun to discuss various subject matters. It’s also funny that those who reacted most defensively are the MKIV people. I enjoyed the dialogue with Dave, actually we have similar test in cars I think.
Emmanuel
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Well, don't I just feel like a right dipstick now. I'll just go and sit in my chair and blush a little.
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If most find your idea of"dialog" offensive...are you?
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quote:
Originally posted by jbottini
If most find your idea of"dialog" offensive...are you?
Offensive why? please explain.
Emmanuel
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Because you can't spell dialogue...
Only joking!
My only disappointment is how few of the UK ACOC members seem to be using this site. I guess they will start to log in over time, but we should do what we can to promote the site in the ACOC
Keith
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Please tell that to Jbotini, I quoted him! (you know these MKIV owners), Just kidding! Anyway it's too bad they don't use it, It could be a wealth of resources, hopefully it will happen. I am curious, why ACE4.6? Did you install a small block in your car?
Emmanuel
A dialogue is a reciprocal conversation between two or more persons. The etymological origins of the word [(in Greek #948;#953;#940;(diá,through) + #955;#972;#947;#959;#962;(logos,word,speech) concepts like flowing-through meaning)] do not necessarily convey the way in which people have come to use the word, with some confusion between the prefix #948;#953;#940;-(diá-,through) and the prefix #948;#953;-(di-, two) leading to the assumption that a dialogue is necessarily beween only two parties. Quote from Wikepedia!
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It is agreat pity we have no contributions from real AC's namely Pre War AC cars, why is this?
Why is it Cobra Cobra Cobra?
Robin
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You mean MKIV, MKIV, MKIV! I don't know much about prewar ACs', I have seen photos and they look good! I would like to find out more about them!
You know just a thought, in what age group is the typical AC owner? this could have something to do about them not using a computer? My daily driver is a Morgan Plus Eight and everybody in the club over here is ancient! Emmanuel
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Auto Carriers designed most if not all the pre war cars, post war AC Designed the 2-Litre,ME3000 & probably the Greyhound.
The Ace was designed by John Tojero & fitted with the Weller AC 2-litre engine, the Ace & Aceca are fine cars but then had Bristol & Ford engines fitted,what a pity AC could not either develop the Weller engine or come up with a new design with over square bore & stroke.
We will see later this year how much the Weller AC engine could have been developed, bore & stroke are not much differant from the Bristol & the AC engine is lighter & more simple in concept, much improvement is possable!
Any AC Cobra cannot really be considered as a pure AC design but they did well in competition & are now worth a great deal of money.
My Post War AC choice is the Aceca with a proper engine!
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I'm a member of Ac Replica Club, Ac Owners club and the 289 register. Why well both give me excellent source of information. Also I'm lucky enough to own Aceca, Ace and a Hawk 289 FIA. The car I like the most is the Aceca, due to the lines, etc.
Anyway, lets make the forum more interesting by sharing information about are cars. Ever forum has problems, just the let the quality come through and the trash will be missed.
The only question I have is this forum seems to get hit with more adverts, etc. than most?
Anyway, lets enjoy the cars and keep share knowledge.
John.
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As a point of interest Hawk Cars make an important contribution supplying spares for Cobra owners etc, not much good for my requirements though!So AC Club members do benifit from the Kit Car world.
Robin
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I will check out their website if they have one!
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Hi, I know Gerry very well, his parts are very good. I believe most of the parts he has for the Ac Cobra's are nearly 99% original style. I have built three Hawk Car's and the quality of the kit is brilliant. The FIA is my very best to date, I managed to get a 289 HiPo + TopLoader from the states.
John.
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Emmanuel.
If you want to know more about Hawke cars you should also go to:-
http://www.the289register.com/
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I'm 44 and have a 57 Ace, AE206. Don't know if that makes me a typical AC Owner but I absolutely love it!!
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Hello folks,
My humble opinion is that access to this Forum should be restricted to members of the ACOC. That would certainly take some of the disappointment away. Also would it limit use of this forum to discuss matters of interest to AC owners. There are certainly enough subjects of interest regarding AC cars, from AC Sociables to MkVs and those of us who "play" here should have a genuine interest to "play" pro-AC.
There are enough forums on the web for discussing non-AC stuff.
Kind regards
Constant Wagner
MkIV
Luxembourg
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You all must have waaaaay too much time on your hands!! I own both a Kirkham 289 FIA and an Ac Aceca and love them both. Pretentious talk about who has or can own the real deal has no place here. I have enjoyed the forum a lot and made many contacts and gathered great technical information. i guess if you are trolling for reactions on the "kits" you will get it. Personally I find it ridiculous:here in Shelby land I feel that it is largely due to the enhousiasts that built the kits that the legend has stayed alive. Trevor Legate legitimately devoted quite a bit of space to the Replicas and kits and for owners of originals to look down on these enthousiasts i find not very befitting. I will agree though that this site should be used for the AC cars and somenone before me justifyably referred to club cobra or cobra country for forums on the kits. Hey, after all: the CSX cars were kits themselves!! Ac built the car, Shelby dropped in engine and trans: what's so different now??
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quote:
Originally posted by Gus Meyjes
You all must have waaaaay too much time on your hands!! I own both a Kirkham 289 FIA and an Ac Aceca and love them both. Pretentious talk about who has or can own the real deal has no place here. I have enjoyed the forum a lot and made many contacts and gathered great technical information. i guess if you are trolling for reactions on the "kits" you will get it. Personally I find it ridiculous:here in Shelby land I feel that it is largely due to the enhousiasts that built the kits that the legend has stayed alive. Trevor Legate legitimately devoted quite a bit of space to the Replicas and kits and for owners of originals to look down on these enthousiasts i find not very befitting. I will agree though that this site should be used for the AC cars and somenone before me justifyably referred to club cobra or cobra country for forums on the kits. Hey, after all: the CSX cars were kits themselves!! Ac built the car, Shelby dropped in engine and trans: what's so different now??
I agree 100%, right on the Mark, well said!
Emmanuel
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I'll drink to the above comment also....
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I'll drink to most anything, rising of sum; setting of moon, but the issue is not the forum, but is the intent of select users.Do what youwill and so wwill the rest of us. But, if you are truly disappointed, I/we understand and will continue to if you chose not to come back.
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I think the forum is all the richer for allowing non-ACOC members(like myself)to participate, and whilst I did cringe a little at Emmanuel`s reception due to his "MkIV point of view", (which several of us tried to re-educate him on[:o)],)by no means do I wish to see members either banned or forced to leave for the odd harsh comment or response.
Perhaps a few more categories would help channel the viewer to more or less relevant threads & postings.
Agreed, this isn`t the place for exhaustive KitCar discussions, but many 'replica' owners have a lot more use from their vehicles than some members, and to discount their knowledgebase is to cut off one`s nose to spite the face.
We`re all here for one main reason, a liking for the cars of AC, be we owners or not. [8D]
We`re all grownups here. [:D]
Now where`s that drink?
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Whimsical as ever young Nik - "we're all grownups here" indeed. You speak for yourself mate.....(now discuss)
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quote:
Originally posted by nikbj68
I think the forum is all the richer for allowing non-ACOC members(like myself)to participate, and whilst I did cringe a little at Emmanuel`s reception due to his "MkIV point of view", (which several of us tried to re-educate him on[:o)],)by no means do I wish to see members either banned or forced to leave for the odd harsh comment or response.
Perhaps a few more categories would help channel the viewer to more or less relevant threads & postings.
Agreed, this isn`t the place for exhaustive KitCar discussions, but many 'replica' owners have a lot more use from their vehicles than some members, and to discount their knowledgebase is to cut off one`s nose to spite the face.
We`re all here for one main reason, a liking for the cars of AC, be we owners or not. [8D]
We`re all grownups here. [:D]
Now where`s that drink?
I agree 100%, It is good to have Non-ACOC members bring their experience and feedback. Kit-Cars have helped keeping AC alive in many peoples' mind. Also, today's kit car owner might be an AC owner tomorrow. As far as my MKIV point of view, it is what it is and it can not be changed easily, since it is based on personal experience. As I have written before, I once owned a MKIV some time ago and did not keep it very long since it was not what I wanted.
There is nothing wrong about discussing the flaws or the good points or a particular vehicle, we have had no problem talking about the 428, but it seems that for some members, the MKIV is off limit. Funny. At the very least this thread has generated quite a bit of reaction and I think it has received more responses that many other. [:)]
Emmanuel
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Quite a few of you owners, and enthusiast's, are not memebers of the ACOC. What can we do to get you to join? (You don't have to be an AC owner to join the club).
Terry
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quote:
Originally posted by terry3000me
Quite a few of you owners, and enthusiast's, are not memebers of the ACOC. What can we do to get you to join? (You don't have to be an AC owner to join the club).
Terry
Pay for hypnotherapy for the other `alf to tolerate my 'interests',
then I`m in![:D]
Years ago, there was an 'associate' member category for non-AC owners, as opposed to full membership, I can`t recall the differences though.
quote:
Originally posted by Trevor Legate
Whimsical as ever young Nik - "we're all grownups here" indeed. You speak for yourself mate.....(now discuss)
Willing to bet I`m one of the youngest here, despite being the 'longest non-admin' member of the forum!
But as the author`s dedication to me in my favourite Cobra book says: "To Nik, who knows about these things...and it sure beats the hell out of growing up!"[8D][8D][8D]
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I have finally realized how I really feel about the MKIV, there is much ambivalence! I anybody cares to hear I will discuss otherwise let it be.
Emmanuel
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quote:
Originally posted by Emmanueld
I have finally realized how I really feel about the MKIV, there is much ambivalence! I anybody cares to hear I will discuss otherwise let it be.
Emmanuel
You'd love the MkIV Lightweight! [:)]
(http://accobra.org.uk/images/large/B_33a.jpg)
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quote:
Originally posted by Chafford
quote:
Originally posted by Emmanueld
I have finally realized how I really feel about the MKIV, there is much ambivalence! I anybody cares to hear I will discuss otherwise let it be.
Emmanuel
You'd love the MkIV Lightweight! [:)]
Looks nice, but can't legally be registered in the US! Too bad I probably would have liked it! Actually I have never seen a lightweight up close, where does it differ from a MKIII? Do you have any pics of the engine bay and of the dash?
Emmanuel
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quote:
Originally posted by Emmanueld
quote:
Originally posted by Chafford
quote:
Originally posted by Emmanueld
I have finally realized how I really feel about the MKIV, there is much ambivalence! I anybody cares to hear I will discuss otherwise let it be.
Emmanuel
You'd love the MkIV Lightweight! [:)]
Looks nice, but can't legally be registered in the US! Too bad I probably would have liked it! Actually I have never seen a lightweight up close, where does it differ from a MKIII? Do you have any pics of the engine bay and of the dash?
Emmanuel
Here are some more pictures (unfortunately no engine pictures). I'm sure Trevor Legate has some though!
http://www.accobra.org.uk/gallery.php
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And here's a later MkIV with the 'lightweight' short nose and MkIII style dash:
http://www.classicdriver.com/uk/find/4100_results.asp?&dealerid=10296&lCarID=1717106
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quote:
Originally posted by Chafford
You'd love the MkIV Lightweight! [:)]
....Here are some more pictures (unfortunately no engine pictures). I'm sure Trevor Legate has some though!
http://www.accobra.org.uk/gallery.php
CAROL who built what????
CaRRoLL Shelby installed engines into chassis`/bodies formed on Thames Ditton AC built wooden bucks! OK, the coilsprung chassis design came from Shelby with much Ford input, but that`s it.
What a gorgeous timewarp Cobra though. One of the 22 of the limited run of 12. I`d love to put some miles on it! [:D]
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Unfortunately, It's still has the not so good looking fiberglass inner fenders and the wimpy exposed master cylinder. Also the gearshift comes out funny! I thought the lightweight would be closer to the MKIII! Also an expansion chamber for the cooling system would go a long way to prevent over-heating! It's warm over here and my MKIV would overheat in traffic! It's alright guys' but I still like my Kirkham better, it's just too far from the original!
Emmanuel
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Why can't a Lightweight be registered in the States? I know of at least one, including the one I almost (should have) purchased in Florida.
Yeah I got loadsa pics thanks.....
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quote:
Originally posted by Trevor Legate
Why can't a Lightweight be registered in the States? I know of at least one, including the one I almost (should have) purchased in Florida.
Yeah I got loadsa pics thanks.....
Trevor, some states are easier than other, but as a general rule the markIV is seen by the government as a car coming from a bona-fide car manufacturer (AC/Autokraft), as such, it must meet all emissions and safety requirements for the year of manufacture (5MPH bumpers, air bags if from the 90s' or newer, etc) The MKIVs met the requirements for their specific years but the light-weight, not having 5MPH bumpers would not.
However, when there is a will there is a way! In some states, it might be possible to register a light-weight as a kit car of if the car can be imported with a title from the 60s' or early 70s' it should be ok!
Some states like Utah or Florida ask very little, some other like California ask for the "World"
Incidently, California is mainly concerned about emissions, so if one wanted to bring a 1993 for example, one would have to install a 1993 or newer Mustang motor/geartbox with all the required pollution control that came with that year mustang, including wiring, engine warning lights etc. plus a mountain of paperwork and it would have to be inspected every 2 years!
When I had my MKIV, I tried to re-register it under California SB-100 rule to avoid smog requirements. SB-100 is a California law that was sponsored by a local Hot-Rodder politician. It says that a Kit-Car can be registered according to it's looks or the date of the engine manufacture, for example a Cobra looks like a 1965 car so 1965 it is, or the engine is from 1966 so the car is 1966. The problem is that they will allow the first 500 cars per year to be registered that way. When I tried that with my markIV they said that AC/Autokraft was a bona-fide manufacturer and that the car did not qualify! Incidently, I think it is the main reason for the relatively low MarkIV resale value, this is also why Shelby chose to import rolling chassis and not finished cars (althought the rules were a lot more relaxed in the 60s').
Emmanuel
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How Ironic. That this thread should be brought back on topic by the one thing which is really disappointing about this forum!
quote:
Originally posted by untommupbox
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Perhaps no-one's really interested ?